Shekalim 8:8 — Do the shekalim still apply without the Beis HaMikdash?

The Lived Mishnah·A Zeman Nakat Project
Tisha B'Av Series
Mishnah 12 of 41
אִם אֶשְׁכָּחֵךְ יְרוּשָׁלָיִם
Part III · Noting cessation
Mitzvos Bound to the Mikdash
One clarifying question, and only one mishnah that meets it head-on: which mitzvos were bound to the Beis HaMikdash and fell silent when it fell, and which never depended on it and go on exactly as before. The churban does not only take — it reveals the line between what was borrowed from the Mikdash and what was always ours to keep.
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MoedSederסדרמוֹעֵד
ShekalimMesechtaמסכתשקלים
8Perekפרקח׳
8Mishnahמשנהח׳
נושא · Topicהַאִם הַשְּׁקָלִים נוֹהֲגִים שֶׁלֹּא בִּפְנֵי הַבַּיִת?Do the shekalim still apply without the Beis HaMikdash?
This Mishnah is:how it's done, then a rule · with a machlokeswhat does that mean?
Mishnah שקלים ח׳:ח׳ · Shekalim 8:8
אֵבָרֵי הַתָּמִיד, נִתָּנִין מֵחֲצִי כֶּבֶשׁ וּלְמַטָּה בַּמִּזְרָח,
וְשֶׁל מוּסָפִין נִתָּנִין מֵחֲצִי כֶּבֶשׁ וּלְמַטָּה בַּמַּעֲרָב,
וְשֶׁל רָאשֵׁי חֳדָשִׁים נִתָּנִין מִתַּחַת כַּרְכֹּב הַמִּזְבֵּחַ מִלְּמָטָה.
הַשְּׁקָלִים וְהַבִּכּוּרִים אֵין נוֹהֲגִין אֶלָּא בִּפְנֵי הַבַּיִת,
אֲבָל מַעְשַׂר דָּגָן וּמַעְשַׂר בְּהֵמָה וְהַבְּכוֹרוֹת נוֹהֲגִין בֵּין בִּפְנֵי הַבַּיִת בֵּין שֶׁלֹּא בִּפְנֵי הַבַּיִת.
הַמַּקְדִּישׁ שְׁקָלִים וּבִכּוּרִים, הֲרֵי זֶה קֹדֶשׁ.
רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן אוֹמֵר, הָאוֹמֵר בִּכּוּרִים קֹדֶשׁ, אֵינָן קֹדֶשׁ.
The limbs of the tamid are placed from the lower half of the ramp eastward,
and those of the musafin are placed from the lower half of the ramp westward,
and those of Rashei Chodashim are placed beneath the upper rim of the mizbeach, below.
Shekalim and bikkurim apply only when the House stands,
but maaser dagan and maaser beheimah and the bechoros apply both when the House stands and when it does not.
One who consecrates shekalim or bikkurim [now] — they are kodesh.
Rabbi Shimon says: one who declares bikkurim kodesh — they are not kodesh.
A reading aid, not an exact translation.

This English is a clause-by-clause rendering to help you follow the Hebrew. It is not word-for-word literal, and it is not a transcript of the recorded shiur — the audio carries explanation and context the translation deliberately leaves out.

case/objectrestrictive rulingpermissive rulingTanna
Structure
The shape of this mishnah▾
עַל הַכֶּבֶשׁ — where the limbs rest
הַמִּזְבֵּחַ מִלְמַעְלָה seen from above — north at the top, the ramp climbing from the south כַּרְכֹּב — the ledge ringing the rim שֶׁל רָאשֵׁי חֳדָשִׁים — מִתַּחַת הַכַּרְכֹּב, עַל דֹּפֶן הַמִּזְבֵּחַ הַכֶּבֶשׁ מֵחֲצִי כֶּבֶשׁ וּלְמַעְלָה תָּמִיד בַּמִּזְרָח מוּסָפִין בַּמַּעֲרָב מֵחֲצִי כֶּבֶשׁ וּלְמַטָּה צָפוֹן דָּרוֹם מִזְרָח ← → מַעֲרָב
וּמִשֶּׁחָרַב — which mitzvos outlive the House
בִּפְנֵי הַבַּיִת
with the Beis HaMikdash
שֶׁלֹּא בִּפְנֵי הַבַּיִת
without it
הַשְּׁקָלִים
the half-shekel
✓
נוֹהֵג
✗
אֵינוֹ נוֹהֵג
הַבִּכּוּרִים
the first fruits
✓
נוֹהֵג
✗
אֵינוֹ נוֹהֵג
מַעְשַׂר דָּגָן
maaser of grain
✓
נוֹהֵג
✓
נוֹהֵג
מַעְשַׂר בְּהֵמָה
maaser of animals
✓
נוֹהֵג
✓
נוֹהֵג
הַבְּכוֹרוֹת
firstborn animals
✓
נוֹהֵג
✓
נוֹהֵג
Summary Chart
Do the shekalim still apply without the Beis HaMikdash?▾
CaseRulingReason
Where on the ramp are the limbs placed?Tamid: lower half, east · Musafin: lower half, west · Rashei Chodashim: beneath the karkov—
Which mitzvos apply only when the Beis HaMikdash stands?Shekalim and bikkurim—
Which apply always?Maaser dagan, maaser beheimah, and bechoros—
If one consecrates shekalim or bikkurim today, are they kodesh?Tanna Kamma: Yes — they are kodesh—
Rabbi Shimon: Bikkurim are not kodesh—
Transcript
A machine transcript of the recorded shiur.

This is the shiur as spoken, transcribed automatically and left unedited — the wording is Ephraim's, and occasional transcription errors remain. It follows the audio word by word.

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Mishnah Insights
An amalgam of commentaries, including original insights.

These insights draw on the commentaries to this Mishnah and on the recorded shiur. Those commentaries often rest on earlier sources — the Gemara, the Yerushalmi, the Rishonim, and one another — without always saying so; where they do, we generally cite the one we read. Every commentary consulted is kept, verbatim, with this card.

Which mitzvos outlive the Bayis▾
עֲשֵׂה לְךָ רַב
R' Shimon bar Yochai · Dor 4 · Usha — רַבִּי שִׁמְעוֹן בֶּן יוֹחַאי

R' Shimon bar Yochai — Rashbi — was a leading talmid of R' Akiva and a central voice of the Usha generation that rebuilt Torah leadership after the Hadrianic persecutions. The Gemara (Shabbos 33b) recounts that he and his son Elazar, under a Roman death-decree, hid in a cave for thirteen years, sustained by a carob tree and a spring; the beis medrash of Rashbi is the traditional source of the Zohar. His halachic signature — R' Shimon omer, threaded throughout the Mishnah — is to reason from the ta'am, the underlying purpose of a mitzvah.

עוֹלָמוֹ שֶׁל הַמִּשְׁנָה
Staging the limbs on the ramp

To keep the day's offerings from being confused, each was set on a different part of the ramp before being carried up to burn. The mizbeach ran south-to-north, the ramp rising from the south; the side toward the Heichal was west. By the standard girsa, the tamid's limbs went on the lower half of the ramp to the east, the musaf's on the lower half to the west, and Rosh Chodesh's below the karkov — likely the soveiv, the ledge encircling the mizbeach partway up. (Other sefarim flip east and west.)

Which mitzvos end with the Bayis, and which outlive it

The masechta closes by sorting them. Shekalim and bikkurim apply only bifnei habayis — the shekel bought the communal korbanos, and bikkurim must be brought to beis Hashem; with no Bayis, neither has a place. But terumos and maasros, maaser behemah, and bechoros continue bein bifnei habayis bein she-lo bifnei habayis. (In practice maaser behemah was left unseparated for fear one might eat it unconsecrated; today one partners with a nochri to exempt the firstborn, and Ashkenazim keep a half-shekel zecher l'machatzis hashekel.)

Consecrate them anyway — are they kodesh?

If someone declares his shekalim or bikkurim hekdesh today, the mishnah rules they take on kedushah and may not be used — because one could, in theory, build a mizbeach and bring them. R' Shimon dissents on bikkurim: they are not kodesh. He may be arguing only on bikkurim, since the Torah ties them to a destination — reishis bikurei admascha tavi beis Hashem — that no longer exists.

שְׁאֵלַת חָכָם

Why is a law about where on the ramp the limbs are placed sitting in Maseches Shekalim at all, rather than in Tamid or Yoma? Lo zachisi leida (Tiferes Yisrael, Yachin).

Series Insights
Series context▾
← Previous
Sotah 9:15
when the sages died, virtues ceased
Mishnah 12 of 41
Shekalim 8:8
Mitzvos tied to the Beis HaMikdash
Next →
Rosh Hashanah 1:3
witnesses and the new month

Where this sits: which mitzvos the Churban suspended

After the series sets out what the Churban changed in the world, this mishnah opens its accounting of the mitzvos bound to the Beis HaMikdash itself. It names two the Churban suspended — the half-shekel (which funded the public korbanos) and bikkurim (brought up to the Bayis) — and, in the same breath, names those that continue without it: maaser dagan, maaser behemah, the bechoros.

The turn the series takes here

Holding the loss and the remainder in one mishnah is the series’ pivot: from cataloging what fell to weighing what still binds. What endures is not incidental — it is how the nation’s mitzvah-life keeps its shape in the Bayis’s absence, which is the work of the mishnayos that follow.

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